Board Thread:Bible Games/@comment-29251550-20160723212758/@comment-29251550-20160725002823

SouthWriter wrote: Andi, I am probably wasting time, but here is a response to your six points:


 * 1) The source of your username is irrelevant. The fact that you chose to use it here, and only here (so far) reveals much about your purpose.
 * 2) If a finite entity revealed himself "once" to you, and then you never saw him again, you would still believe he or she existed. God has been revealing Himself from the very beginning of time to select persons.
 * 3) Backing up "claims" in His Word was done by the agency of people He trusted. He conversed with Adam, walked with Enoch, gave instructions to Noah, called Abraham, and showed Himself to Moses and the tribes of Israel in "safe" manifestations. He spoke to prophets and confirmed His word through miracles and fulfilled prophecies.
 * 4) You both claim that God cannot "use a book" and then say that all you know about Him is from that book. So this point leads to the next one:
 * 5) You want want God to make a "personal appearance" just for you, or at least for someone you know. The answer to this objection is in the next point:
 * 6) God does not move someone by request. This "moving" is by that personal appearance you seem to want, and that is my prayer, that He will choose to so show Himself in the person of the Holy Spirit. It is not something you "make happen," though if you happen to ever actually feel His leading, it will be proof that he IS moving. And finally,
 * 7) Prayer is a word that we use in the English language that means to make a request of One we trust will answer. It is foolish to ask for something from someone who you don't trust and expect an answer. That prayer "doesn't work" for you does not prove that it doesn't work for others.

To recap, Your original protest has been adequately answered. Christians, by definition as followers of Christ, do not look down from heaven and laugh at "innocent" people burning in hell. The one case when one person looks from heaven (Lazarus with Abraham) to hell (an unnamed rich man) is in a parable spoken by Jesus. In that case, there is no glee, but only an admonition to the guilty man. FA attempted to paint a picture of hell in many colors, but the point is, there are no "innocent" folk in hell.

You have claimed that the "only evidence" Christians have given you is the Bible. If this is so, then you have not known any Christians that live a life that reflects the character of God, as seen in Jesus. This evidence is much more convincing than any words on a page, though a mind prepared by God will see Him in His Word.

Your six points, based on the premise that you do not believe God exists apart from direct contact, is largely spot on. You cannot ever know of His existence without such contact. You will know when and if this happens. That is my prayer for you, but I do not know the mind of God. I trust Him to do what is best in your case.

To the Glory of God,

SouthWriter (talk) 20:00, July 24, 2016 (UTC)

"The source of your username is irrelevant. The  fact  that you chose to use it here, and only here (so far) reveals much about your purpose." What you just said proved my point earlier.

"If a finite entity revealed himself "once" to you, and then you never saw him again, you would still believe he or she existed." Yeah, but that doesn't mean those it didn't reveal itself to would believe.

"God has been revealing Himself from the very beginning of time to select persons." That's the problem. He only reveals himself to a few people. If he revealed himself to the entire planet at once, that would solve the problem once and for all.

" Backing up "claims" in His Word was done by the agency of people He trusted." What's that suppose to mean?

" He conversed with Adam, walked with Enoch, gave instructions to Noah, called Abraham, and showed Himself to Moses and the tribes of Israel in "safe" manifestations. He spoke to prophets and confirmed His word through miracles and fulfilled prophecies." That's not backing up claims.

" You both claim that God cannot "use a book" and then say that all you know about Him is from that book." I said you can't use the book to prove he exists. I've read about the horrible acts he's committed, yes, but that doesn't really prove whatever you're getting at.

" You want want God to make a "personal appearance" just for you, or at least for someone you know." I didn't say just for me, I meant for the whole world. Then this whole thing could be resolved.

" God does not move someone by request." I said nothing about moving.

" It is not something you "make happen,"" Did I say I had to make it happen?

" though if you happen to ever actually feel His leading, it will be proof that he  IS  moving." No it won't.

" Prayer is a word that we use in the English language that means to make a request of One we trust will answer." That doesn't mean it works.

" It is foolish to ask for something from someone who you don't trust and expect an answer." But the thing is, if God actually did answer prayers, and I mean REALLY answer them, it would be a good way to prove his existence, but he doesn't even do that.

" That prayer "doesn't work" for you does not prove that it doesn't work for others." It's just words. Words don't solve problems. Action does.

" To recap, Your original protest has been adequately answered. Christians, by definition as followers of Christ, do not look down from heaven and laugh at "innocent" people burning in hell." I said they SAY that they will.

" The one case when one person looks from heaven (Lazarus with Abraham) to hell (an unnamed rich man) is in a parable spoken by Jesus. In that case, there is  no  glee, but only an admonition to the guilty man" What guilty man?

" FA attempted to paint a picture of hell in many colors, but the point is, there are no "innocent" folk in hell." Oh, so people who have different views than you aren't innocent at all? Is that it?

" You have claimed that the "only evidence" Christians have given you is the Bible." Well it is.

" If this is so, then you have not known any Christians that live a life that reflects the character of God, as seen in Jesus." Excuse me?

This evidence is much more convincing than any words on a page, though a mind prepared by God will see Him in His Word." But a book doesn't prove something.

" Your six points, based on the premise that you do not believe God exists apart from direct contact, is largely spot on." I said if he actually did reveal himself to more people, even the whole world, that would solve things.